Visionstream now has 70% of ‘wanted’ field staff; sugars deal for hold-outs
Amid strikes, the broadband ban, Carter-gate and Salary-gate, Telecom’s new contractor is apparently closing in on its target number to sign owner/operator contracts - in part thanks to a series of sweeteners.
Last night a Telecom spokesman said “Visionstream has now signed up more than 70% of their field workers. That’s what I call progress.” His comments were backed by a letter from Visionstream’s New Zealand country manager, Andrew Stevens.
And by both company’s unquantified goals, it is progress.
On August 18, Visionstream said 50% of field staff had signed.
The new contractor still refuses to say how many of the 900 displaced Downer Edi and Tranfield staff it needs to signed its new owner/operator contracts.
The EPMU claims that Visionstream said it could do the same work as Downer and Transfield in Auckland for 70% of the cost, and that its required contractor numbers and rates will reflect that target.
A spokesman for Visionstream last night said the company was not trying to make lines engineers insecure and more ready to sign by refusing to reveal its target number of hires. Revealing a specific target number of owner/operators by its October 1 deadline would be more likely to have that affect, the company says.
In a statement last night Visionstream’s Mr Stevens said suggestions the owner/operator model would see workers’ incomes halved were “well wide of the mark”.
“Our rates have been calculated so that field staff maintaining a level of output in line with the current industry average can expect to maintain a similar level of income, and those with good productivity levels can achieve a significantly higher income,” he said.
Mr Stevens said Telecom’s Chorus division had commissioned Deloitte to independently analyse its rates, and found them comparable to contractors working for other providers.
The sweeteners
While the EPMU has relentlessly referred to Visionstream’s “one-year” contracts, Mr Stevens says the agreement being offered is for three years.
It's not clear if political pressure has come into play, as Labour alleges, or if Telecom has given Visionstream and wiggle room - or otherwise encouraged it to sort things out.
But is is now clear that Visionstream has sugared several elements of its original offer. In a letter to lines engineers still considering the owner/operator terms, dated August 19, Mr Stevens adds a number of new clauses to sugar the deal, they are:
Rates
“Based on feedback received regarding the pricing of rates, we have made some amendments to further benefit the owner operator."
Delayed payments
Visionstream intends to continue its characteristic to pay on time. However, to add further protection to the owner operator, a new clause has been inserted requiring Visionstream to pay interest if our payments to owner operators are late.
"Material pricing"
"As an added benefit to owner operators, a new clause has been included to the Contract which formalises fixed prices for materials when you purchase them from Visionstream or our nominated supplier over twelve monthly periods."
Contractor Intellectual Property
"A clause has been amended to clearly identify and protect any Intellectual Property that the owner operator brings to the Contract or develops in their own right during the term of the Contract."
Selling your business
In the event that the owner operator wishes to sell their business, a clause has been
amended in the Contract stating that Visionstream will not unreasonably withhold approval for assignment.
Back to home
Back to top
Print
Latest
NBR SERVICES
SUBSCRIPTIONS
Sign up for NBR subscriber content or email alerts
Comments and questions38
come on visionstream say how you have signed up. Its not that hard to sou have we have this many people signed.
saying you have 70% of the people needed still doesnt say anything about how many people you have.
Join Telecom management!!!Its quailty and not quantity that counts. Most of the techs that have joined vision stream are the ones that are inexperienced or know that they are lucky to have a job. In addition VS must have made some of their new staff redundant because a 4 weeks ago they had 70% of the staff reqd,then it was 50% and now its back to 70% again. unfortunately if this goes on the cream of the techs will be lost to the industry or the country altogether
Visionstream, keep deluding yourselves. It should read "70% of the 30% that have said yes we`ll sign". Hilarious..the clock is ticking, the weathers turning to crap and i would say the Government will be getting a little impatient, wanting to roll out their Fibre to node promise. Northpower would be the better option. Tick, Tick...
Northpower is also facing rechrenchments not good
Nobody but the union wins if the banter and industrial action continues.
The union still get paid regardless.
The customers and staff both lose
WHAT DO YOU BASE YOUR COMMENTS ON AT LEAST THEY HAVE REPORTS DETAILING HOW BAD THIS WILL
BE FOR STAFF AND WE ALL KNOW THAT IT IS AN OLD NETWORK. ITS SEEMS TO BE OK THAT TELECOM
CAN TALK AS MUCH AS THEY LIKE ABOUT HOW GOOD
THIS ALL IS,BUT IF THE UNION TELLS THE TRUTH
THEY ARE IN IT FOR THE MONEY GET A LIFE.
"Mr Stevens said Telecom’s Chorus division had commissioned Deloitte to independently analyse its rates, and found them comparable to contractors working for other providers".
OK then, prove it. Put your workings out in the public domain so that we can found out where we went horribly wrong in our calculations. My accountant would be most interested.
A $5M Bonus Package to the Boss with the Company that shows a 4o%+ Fall in Performance...Where does Logic & Good Business Sense back this up...Ignoring your HIGHLY-SKILLED workforce ( ie..those in FrontLine contact with all your Customers )...If VisionStream's offer is so Wonderful why not Roll-over the existing conditions + wait for the Staff to "SEE THE LIGHT'?..TO AM : IGNORANCE IS BLISS AS CUSTOMERS + STAFF HAVE ALWAYS BEEN LOSING. I am a Skilled Linesman with Advanced Trade Cert with 20YRS Experience (incl 3YRS Contracting in Europe)I'm not Lazy,Easily Led,or a Cowboy.I try to give Customers as much Satisfaction as Possible witin the Time Constraints allowed + am constantly having to Apologise for the State of the Network rundown by TELECOM. MOST(60%+)Faults in Rural Areas and smaller Urban-Areas are Due to antiquated networks that have been patched + re-patched time and again.Telecom ignores these Customers as the Revenue income is not as great as in a larger Metropolitan Area...Techs are constantly having to BEG fo cables to be replaced
Anyone heard Mr Steven from VisionStream on Radio New Zealand's checkpoint programme 26/08, 17:38?
http://static.radionz.net.nz/assets/audio_item/0003/2045667/ckpt-20090826-1738-Visionstream_confident_of_full_staffing_by_October-m048.asx
BOY, this guy is pretty GOOD at his job. If you are new to this dispute JOE PUBLIC, then take note: He is DELUGING you.
He clearly tells Mary that The loan required by the new owner operator will not be in the order of tens of thousands of dollars. MATE, who are you kidding? You will not get very far using a couple of pliers and screwdrivers when working on todays digital network. I've priced my test equipment at $36K and thats the bear minimum. Still need a van, public liability insurance, cellphone etc. Oh, did I mention I NEED to pay VisionStream for my uniform?
Mr Stevens says we can work for other companies as a independent contractor.. REALLY? Their contract clearly states I should be available to them 7am to 7pm 24/7. Telecom is the most dominant player where I live and so I will be totally reliant on VisionStream for my income. I will be a DEPENDENT contractor, This is NOT A TRUE owner/operator model as they represent it.
The real kicker is there is no guaranteed work. WHO in their right mind would set themselves in a new business this way? Imagine going into the bank for a loan based on the above proposition.
Mr Stevens again says this model works throughout the world. YES, he would be telling the truth if it was a TRUE owber/operator model, say Lawn mowing.
We have spoken to our Oz colleagues where VisionStream operates. Things gave not worked out for them. Their rates have gone down and they are worst off every contract renewal. Many only see bankruptcy and despair.
ENOUGH of your lies and half truths Mr Stevens.
It is surely a mans' right to trade his skills/ labour for a wage ?
If you do not reconsider then the workforce you need we have left the industry forever.
we're being %^&&*^% over here to m8 but believe me down here we're backing u fella's all the way
with the last poster. He is 100% correct. We don't know ANY techs who have signed up with VS. We do know of Managers who have been employed by VS but not Techs! So Andrew Stevens is lying outright to the media & the NZ public.
Telecom charge $120 for one new business line and a jackpoint,contractor gets $75
Telecom charge $240 for two new business lines and jackpoints, contractor gets $75.
Telecom charge $360 for three new business lines and jackpoints, contractor gets $75.
Thats how Telecom can afford to pay $5 million, and why no one wants to contract to Visionstream.
Prices approx.
Stand Firm and dont sign.You are winning the battle.This is a propaganda release to make you panic and beleive there are no jobs left.Dont let the aussies push you around.
Actually I wonder if IRD etc would think these were real independant businesses and not just employees - don't have chance to do other business - can't influence prices, even wear their uniform. Sounds like an employee to me.
Some techs have signed but are sitting and waiting. Most haven`t brought tools and none have forked out for vans. Why would you when anything could happen in the next 4 weeks. Even Radio talkback are starting to latch on to the story. All very interesting.
Havoc would have struck all over North with last nights electrical storm! . pressure. pressure, pressure!!!! There is such a thing as Karma, just sit tight -
Don't sign boys.
Telecom bought in Field servicing Contracting many years ago for one reason only. Contracting means lower pay and poorer conditions of employment,which in turn means more profit. They continue with a new contracting model (dependent operator) which turns the norm on its head for the ordinary worker. Now you take on all the costs & risks with the head contractor creaming a tidy percentage off your hard work. Tell them its a business opportunity & they will be ok.
Telecom you are an unethical and immoral bunch, deserving little sympathy from the NZ public.
Spot, Remember old Indian proverb....
My kar-ma will run over your dog-ma.
it has been proven over and over by us in the field that nothing visionstream claims can be proven. Even their own calculator with new rates cannot convince anybody to sign because nothing can be relied upon.
clause 2 b in the contract states;
2.1 This Contract records the agreement of the Parties to the matters set out in it and:
(b) does not;
(i) require the Company to issue any Purchase Orders to the Contractor;
(ii) guarantee the Contractor any minimum amount of Services;
(iii) have any effect on the Company’s ability to use other contractors to provide Services similar to or the same as the Services, and the Company will not be liable to the Contractor in respect of any of these matters.
There u have it. NO GUARANTEE whatsoever of work.
and then we have clause 18: THE REAL PROBLEM and visionstream's TRUMP CARD
18 Information provided by the Company
The Company does not warrant, guarantee or make any representation as to the accuracy, completeness or adequacy for the purposes of the Contract of any information provided by the Company prior to the date of the Contract (Pre-Contract Information) and the Company will not be liable to the Contractor in connection with the Pre-Contract Information, the provision of the Pre-Contract Information or the non provisions of any other information by the Company.
So vs, make all the claims you like , your contract still is flawed and will not be acceptable to us. 70% signed cannot be proven and cause it does not exist and you know it.
We all know by now your manner of doing business is to lie and lie , and lie , and lie until you get what you want.
NOT THIS TIME.
So my friends and colleagues & readers
What clause 18 means is this:
visionstream can effectively and at will make any false statement to promote, sell , polish , sweeten their owner operator model to get duped telco techs to sign and when the contract comes up for renewal after 12 months they can change anything they want like the rates and reduce it . If you dis agree with the reduced rates after this 12 month period, your contract with them is terminated but you still sit with the debt you made to start your business.
Their entire business plan depends upon the lies they sell.
The commercial barrister who scrutinised their contract emphasised this provision in the contract that permits them to lie before you sign ..
AND another clause 31.7 allows them to prevent any court to accept that its because of their info ( lies) they provided that induced you into signing on because you relied upon this info to make your decision. They worded the contract in such a manner that no reliance can be made upon anything they said prior to your signing on.
You signed to accept that condition even though you could not rely upon any info so when your "business ' fails its entirely your fault and visionstream cannot be held liable.
and visionstream carry on with business as usual with other surviving contractors while you drown in debt .
That is what they want you to sign on for.
Read your contract if you doubt. get the barristers report to verify anything I have written.
Find another job in the meantime. Avoid these crooks at all costs.
Signed up 70%, that’s funny I was one of 250 on strike last Monday in Auckland alone, then there are the 100% of the North Island who have not signed, Visonstream, employing someone who has a van and no idea how to fix and install telecom lines doesn’t count, I got my redundancy letter today, if you think that will make me sign, think again.
Visionstream offers the same a blue chip, be prepared to sell you house when you find your running at a loss.
The following are comments starting to appear in other forums.
Quoted from Geekzone post today.
Hi Telecom,
Why are you not suing Downer/Transfield/Visionstream for non-performance during these ridiculous strikes?
If the idiots working for your engineering contractors are being whiny that's Downer/Transfield/Visionstream's problem, they should sack them, there must be other people out there willing to actually do some work.
Frankly waiting a week for faults to be resolved because of a pack of drama queens isn't really acceptable.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
From TV3 news web site.
katrina
27 Aug 2009 11:44a.m.
Who needs that much money to live on. It is salaries like that that contributed to the current financial ruin of the world. 20% of the population having 80% of the wealth is crap. He doesn't deserve the money as
I have been without my business phone line since Saturday!!
Keep calling Telecom Faults line.......if you have a fault, just keep logging it in, hour after hour after hour, keep the pressure on Telecom. It is not the Techs wanting to be problematic
to Joe Public, but, this is the only way to hit home the facts to the FAT CATS' GREED. o So don't give the Downer and Transfield and union guys a hard time, support them now and this major issue will be brought to a head sooner. If not things WILL get far worse.
Go to the EPMU site and read some of the conditions that are in the contract that VS wants these guys to fall for and if you have any brains at all, you will figure out who is in the right you silly person.
Wait times for connections and faults in major centres have gone from an average 2-3 days to more than 3 weeks!
Right now that's because of industrial action. under Visionstream's model it will be business as usual.
Stay strong together guys! It's the only way to win for yourselves and for the rest of us who rely on the network!
Most of the comments made about v/stream are true we are talking a numbers game here where i work at least 75% have signed mostly work permit and apprentice people the 25% left are union members holding out, translate this figure nationally the guys have not stuck together they have signed pledges intially stating they would not sign with v/stream and support industrail action the peeling off will cont. Will this be enough for the epmu to neg with? Will v/steam neg and when? or has trust honour and ones word gone in todays society? Your comments please
To the Transfield and Downer techs affected by all this I've set up a forum to discuss these issues. Click over to techsupport.org.nz to add your comments, sign the petition, vote in the online poll, share your experiences and support other techs. By techs for techs.
http://tiny.cc/XdUJE
or
http://techsupport.org.nz
In the early 90s I worked as Telecom subcontractor.
I set up my own company, brought my own van, all the tools.
Worked from dawn to dusk doing new connections for 3 years.
Each year the codes you could charge for each job where whittled down. e.g Two cabinets, only charge for one. DP & ETP connection, only charge one not two. Aerial spans the same, etc etc
I hardly ever got the nice jobs like 5 trunks to demarc. They always gave these jobs that could make your day worth it to the employeed techs. All the jobs with little margin went to the sub contractors.
After 3 years of seeing my income reduce each year to the point I was getting less than what I used to earn as a wage with Telecom yet I had to pay my own fuel, mobile, tooks, vehicle, insurance, accountants, taxes, acc, bookeeping, etc I chucked it sold the van and kept the tools because there is no secondhand market for them.
This is dejavu all over again.
Those who have signed with Visionstream are going to find out the hard way.
Why do you think Visionstream will only offer 1 year contract when they have a 10 year contract themselves?
Visionstream has come in offereing Telecom such a good price because they aren't going to pay for vans, tools, insurance, taxes, computers, mobiles, etc. YOU ARE..... FOOLS
Exactly right. Happened (and still happening) here in Oz.
It's the road to ruination. Believe me, been there, done it.
You are as bad as VS. The numbers your quoting aren't true. We, the techs both union & non-union have stuck together & we are getting stronger. So please don't spread misinformation.
Landlines throughout the world are becoming increasingly uneconomical to maintain. We are still waiting for new technology to replace cables but wireless has not yet fully come of age and still carries a huge price penalty.
Telecom has failed to properly maintain its land line services over the last 20 years and still has nothing to replace them with. Obsolete exchanges can only be propped up with kiwi ingenuity as long as kiwis are paid fair wages to do it. Kiwis know that any contract with VIRUSSCUM would be an ever decreasing spiral into bankruptcy as the owner operator would be expected to do all of the work that telecom doesn't want to pay for AT HIS OWN EXPENSE.
May I summarize all of the above comments by saying " Fork off Visionstream, we don't want anything to do with you"
If anybody is being suckered into VAGINASCUM contracts with the promise of potential tax benefits as an owner/operator, you had better check with your own accountant first, as there are no benefits allowable to you under their contract.
Mr Stevens said
“We’re here for the long haul. If we are going to build a successful business in New Zealand, we need to provide technicians with an offer that rewards them properly for the skills they possess and the work they carry out, and we need to ensure that the next generation of workers sees our industry as a viable career choice.”
Note he says ''need to'' not ''have done''
That is all we ask for Mr Stevens, it's called a collective employment contract, so contact the EPMU and make it happen.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU0908/S00715.htm
Looks like Telstra in Australia are ripping into its workers also offering something called "Work Choices". Offering owner operator models or don`t get a payrise. Telstra still retained a large tech workforce but intend culling them. Apparently they don`t need them all. This sounds like it will open their whole network up. Slightly suspicious especially with the fibre to home project coming up in Oz.
STICK TOGETHER AND DON"T SIGN UP!
Don't take the pressure from Vs, keep going back at the contract and reminding yourself of the facts stated and how there is simply nothing favouring you at all, it is all slanted VS way, not your way, just don't sign, you are strongest as a collective group.
Just heard that one of the downers guys who sighed up and finishes on the 1/10 has told by VS he is not required until 7/11..showing there true colours already.
They haven't got enough Techs & are stalling. Stay strong guys. I can smell victory already!
The time has come for everyone to pick a side or get out of the kitchen (industry).
If everyone is decisive, this war will be a short one.
Win, lose or draw, we can then make rational decisions and get on with our lives...
No more fence-sitting for those who are letting others do their fighting.
The only way that we are going to get a fair deal, is for us to fight this together.
The last time we will have the opportunity to fight, is right now.
Pity on those who decide to bend over and expose themselves to this exploitive contract. In time, they will be screwed. (Visionstream are doing it to their own in Aussie, what makes you think they won't do it to you here?)
Some may think that there is safety in signing in numbers, or working for Tri-co, Bi-co or Homo-co. They are wrong. Individually or collectively, they are all gonna be screwed until they squeal, and then they are gonna be screwed some more.
Too late to fight then..
Stand and fight or, bend over and get screwed. Your choice.